Fixing Negates

[Grimm(Admin)]

I have issues with negates. What we have by itself is just too strong. And easily bustable cough Atom cough. But its clearly still really strong despite that. And has claimed casualties and brought attention to issues caused by other effects. I think some of these effects are in need of re balancing. But first the elephants.

Like MTG we use a keyword system. But unlike MTG with many cards. We have an easily accessible glossary for our effects. And effects trumps rules. That their design. But rules do keep effects in check.

Keys words like MTG, but plays more like yugioh. This one is self explanatory. Once you have your pieces on the board. You have cards you essentially can almost play for free.

Its not like yugioh. The systems in mind are the following: Bakugan, gate, Card Count (the amount of cards you can play in a round based on card cost. This will be reduced here in the near future.), card classification is simple yet complex, Everyone has the same equal access to effects and card slots, and you make your own cards. These may not seem like to much alone, but oh boy. Do they stack. With obtaining them, and crafting the card. You naturally want to use them. But ummm. How to completely balance a card is wack is many ways. I wont argue. Even to me it can feel a little absurd (but with good intentions. I promise.)

This system is newer than the old system. Its nearly the same as what we have now, but card play amount is different, and cards need effects and slots purchased separately. (this changes the game greatly.)

Clearly Negates wont be the only reworked effects. But I'm open to other ideas on negates. And no. Just limiting the amount of negates only works with a more constrained card play like the old system. And unbeatable combos become an issue.

Finally proposed changes. I will follow up to this one later. But the first one is this. I want to propose this card type that should be obvious. But have been hesitant on. A new card type. These will all be premade and must be purchased. But GENERIC CARDS! These are typeless cards with no special requirements. I'm also thinking about calling them Grey Cards. To make them usable. I will make them decent. But as a balance. They are very week. but because they are extremely week. You can play them regardless of situation. How it affects card count is also important. (this is relevant to negates.)

[Mordekaiser]

Hi, Grimm. I think it is not problem to write here. OK, my first proposal is that we remove G-Power Increase, Decrease and Transfer effects from blue card and give it to Gray card effects, then we add doubling and halving G-Power to blue card effects. My second proposal is that we don't need any gray card slot and instead we can create a new shop system that we can buy this gray cards automatically (like we don't need to buy a gray card to create a gray card. Instead we buy only just a card with effect). My third proposal is that we can divide this gray card into elements like for example Pyrus Gray cards, Darkus gray cards, and for example for Haos bakugan we don't need buy Darkus card. My 4th and final proposal is that Gray card can obtain only 1 effect.

And about Negate effect(I am just talking about only negate effect) we can add also this effect to Gray card, but for purchasing a new negate card we must spend 1500-2000$. It is just my opinion for negate cards. 

[Grimm(Admin)]

So I'm going to ignore most of this post for:
A. Not being completely relevant. That first paragraph felt like a tangent that ignored the first post.
B. Its not in line for the goals. As the Admin who has to prioritize the game. I'm just missing play data. And what play data I do get is shown off in... Some dramatic ways.

But the two points I will comment on.
1. I get the intent but the grey cards are meant to be a system to balance out attribute locking. That will be my goal.
2. A grey negate is already in mind. But this changes nothing to fix negates, and only makes it harder to get, nor fixes the issues for people who already have negate cards outside of hurting their decks.

Thank you for commenting, but there is an overall vision and your idea overall... Is kind a bad based on how things work as now. I'm trying to improve, NOT REPLACE.

(EDIT: grammar check, also making negates harder to get in itself is not a bad idea. But how you went about it was, how it was bad.)

[Grimm(Admin)]

As for my purposed change to the negate effect in itself. Creation Blaze Hayes You may want to way in greatly here.

We change negate with the following changes.
First: We make it a green effect, and not a blue effect anymore.
Second: Negate can only effect one effect on a card. Not the whole card.
Three: With the first two changes in mind. Lift some of the negation restrictions. Starting with how many negates you play a round. To how many you can play in a row. (Example being: You can't play two on the same post, and you can't play them on one post directly after another.)
These ideas are subject to change.

And a card making change: From now on The keywords must be placed on the card. Any restriction/conditions being group to the keyword in parentheses.

[Blaze Hayes]

Jan 3, 2023 15:59:12 GMT -6 Grimm(Admin) said:

As for my purposed change to the negate effect in itself. Creation Blaze Hayes You may want to way in greatly here.

We change negate with the following changes.
First: We make it a green effect, and not a blue effect anymore.
Second: Negate can only effect one effect on a card. Not the whole card.
Three: With the first two changes in mind. Lift some of the negation restrictions. Starting with how many negates you play a round. To how many you can play in a row. (Example being: You can't play two on the same post, and you can't play them on one post directly after another.)
These ideas are subject to change.

And a card making change: From now on The keywords must be placed on the card. Any restriction/conditions being group to the keyword in parentheses.

I dont mind this but maybe there are just simply some effects that can't be stoped by a negate. For example can't negate a reflect as they are both counters. And if negates can stop any other counter negate would still be the more powerful option.

[Creation]

I do like the idea of some effects superseding the ability to be negated. Reflect is a good contender for getting that, but perhaps we also extend it to ghoul triggers to set traps with?

In addition, limiting the number you can play per turn feels like a much better balancing point to me than limiting the number you can use per round. If you can only play one per turn and you can't play them back to back, it makes them a bit more impactful and important to use in the right situation.

Following up with that, if I may suggest this change, a Negate can only affect a card played by an opponent during their last turn. This will make them even more important tools at your disposal, and can set up some interesting traps. In addition, perhaps a Red Negate Effect that can go further back in the turn order?

[Grimm(Admin)]

I really do like these suggestions. Blaze. Creations, love it or hate it. We need to meet up in the week and make some changes. This post will remain open till changes are implemented.